How To Get Over the Thought of "Dirtying Girls By Fucking Her"

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MattsCrib
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Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:27 am

Lostcause wrote:
Mon Aug 31, 2020 8:20 am
Wow, what a piece of bullshit.
MattsCrib wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:33 pm
Guys, you have to understand that this feeling isn't just "societal programming" and disturbing - it's biologically NORMAL to be repulsed by women who are/have been promiscuous. It's a natural "flight or fight" reflex of sorts

Rats - "icky" because the possibility of diseases (mainly the plague)
Spiders - "icky" because of the possibility of being venomous
Blood - because it shows obvious damage, danger
Feeling that women are "dirty" when they've had a lot of sex (even if it's with you) - the possibility of them being impregnated by other men (your genes not going to survive), the possibility of diseases, not to mention your "ego" getting in the way (if she has had a lot of partners, she wont love me the same as i'll be just an object etc.)

Our brains aren't evolved for this "free love" society of hook-ups and casual sex (hell, we haven't evolved for a lot of things in the modern society). Yes, on a rational level, it's completely harmless, but you have to understand where it comes from and act accordingly :D (whether you want to change your views and get over it is up to you)

Just telling people to "get over it" or trying to rationalize a primitive feeling doesn't help much.

All in all, reframing thoughts might help, like in "You Can't afford the luxury of a negative thought" :D
Ok, lets assume it's a nature's, not cultural thing. Lets skip the part where we are civilised people, with ways to RECOGNIZE, TREAT and AVOID stds. Lets skip the part where we should have RATIONAL CONTROL over the PRIMITIVE INSTINCTS.

How are the girls having sex worse then men having sex then? Its not like its only women who can spread dieseases. We can do it aswell. Why should we hold women to a standard where they are worse for possibly spreading dieseases, when we possibly do the exact same thing - having sex with plenty of diffrent partners. Are we, men somehow lower value because of that? Stop rationalizing your ideas with nature.
If we were rational human beings we wouldn't do animalistic things in the first place, but we aren't.

We'd only have sex in order to have children and raise a family, we wouldn't cheat, we would like girls with bad personalities, girls wouldn't find literal criminals attractive just because of appearance etc.

Sex = pleasurable BECAUSE nature had to make us somehow breed.

I can post countless studies on how partner count affects women.

People always keep telling that "we are rational human beings, therefore we should act rationally" - I completely agree! Then why is everybody wanting sex with multiple partners because "it make peepee/vagennah feel gut" and not have proper monogamous relationships where it's not based on lust? Because we are NOT humans :D

It's completely fine if it wouldn't be hypocritical, as in "let's act like humans according to one parameter and animals according to the other"

Also, show me an average guy who has a lot of sex and spreads std-s. It's often the argument of "but men do it too!".

No. No they don't. I know a HANDFUL of guys who have more than 10 partners.

Seeing a girl have many partners is like seeing Jeff Bezos eating burgers while the majority of people are starving.

One more thought: if it's only cultural, why have I felt it being gross for the majority of my life while living with pretty liberal friends?

Why is it worse when women have a lot of sex? It isn't worse and she is in no way evil or bad - it's just gross. Just is. Like a really short guy is unattractive to a girl for example.

(then again, I've had a lot of phobias throughout my life, so it really could just be me)

Edit : not trying to throw shade on anyone - I'm here to become an overall better person, so I'd love if my views were changed. Hell, I want my views to be changed - I don't want to feel like that.
Last edited by MattsCrib on Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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AGF
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Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:28 am

MattsCrib wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:33 pm

Our brains aren't evolved for this "free love" society of hook-ups and casual sex (hell, we haven't evolved for a lot of things in the modern society).
Genghis Khan and the vikings disagree.

Do you have any scientific sources for your statement? I would argue that the exact opposite is the case but society nowadays suppresses our primal desire for sex. The recent surge in online dating and hookup culture is more a move back to what our ancestors were already doing hundreds and thousands of years ago.

High-value man have always had multiple partners for the entire history of mankind. Look at any high-value male hundreds of years ago and you'll find a man with mulitple women. It was even more acceptable back then than it is now.
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Lostcause
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Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:49 am

.If we were rational human beings we wouldn't do animalistic things in the first place, but we aren't.
Part of being rational is taking your animalistic feelings into consideration, but not letting them control your life. Thats what being rational means. A rational person has sex because she/he knows it is rationaly good decision to have it, not because she/he NEEDS to whatever the cost of fullfilling this desire.
.Also, show me an average guy who has a lot of sex and spreads std-s. It's often the argument of "but men do it too!".
Whats the point, do you want me to give you names, or something?
But well, I guess the women get STDs from masturbation in the first place, its not like they get it from.. men. Gross.
. One more thought: if it's only cultural, why have I felt it being gross for the majority of my life while living with pretty liberal friends?
You were not raised in a bubble. You are exposed to different opinions even if you was not raised strict.


I truly believe no one should be having sex as long as he thinks its gross/degrading for a woman. We can argue whether its good or bad, but if you truly feel like this, then you are a real asshole consciously making the women worse/gross for your own pleasures sake.
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Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:54 am

. Genghis Khan and the vikings disagree
Not just them. What about the Romans and Greeks doing orgies on a regular basis? Or the medieval times and visiting brothels being common thing?
Its the recent times that did something gross and taboo from a sex.
We have a benefit of living in times of hygiene and medicine where we can recognize and treat stds, yet make no use of it, because we are still mentaly 100years behind, thinking its gross.
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MattsCrib
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Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:56 am

AGF wrote:
Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:28 am
MattsCrib wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:33 pm

Our brains aren't evolved for this "free love" society of hook-ups and casual sex (hell, we haven't evolved for a lot of things in the modern society).
Genghis Khan and the vikings disagree.

Do you have any scientific sources for your statement? I would argue that the exact opposite is the case but society nowadays suppresses our primal desire for sex. The recent surge in online dating and hookup culture is more a move back to what our ancestors were already doing hundreds and thousands of years ago.

High-value man have always had multiple partners for the entire history of mankind. Look at any high-value male hundreds of years ago and you'll find a man with mulitple women. It was even more acceptable back then than it is now.
They fucked maybe 10 girls in their village. Ghengis khan is an exception. Most guys who fucked a lot probably died from std-s, most women who fucked a lot (and the did not that much, it just wasn't possible) died from giving birth/std-s.

We aren't evolved for porn, hookups with 20, 30, 100 partners, condoms, birth control on a large scale level.

Some scale of societal control is necessary for humanity - we can't just tell that our ancestors were right. They also raped and killed. They were freaking retarded in all of their animalistic ways :D the reason we are here right now IS ethics and control. (ethics mostly from religion I guess)

I've read somewhere that a top guy had an average amount of 7 women back in the day (impregnated)

And yes, for some reason a guy who has fucked many girls is high value, a girl who has fucked many guys is low value (biological reasons?)

Then, again, we are not here to solve societal problems :D I'd love to live in a monogamous no sex /only for conception society, but I simply can't, so I have to make what's best for me.

This system is great for most young women and select hyper sexual attractive men, so for about 80% of people it works out :D
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MattsCrib
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Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:57 am

Lostcause wrote:
Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:49 am
.If we were rational human beings we wouldn't do animalistic things in the first place, but we aren't.
Part of being rational is taking your animalistic feelings into consideration, but not letting them control your life. Thats what being rational means. A rational person has sex because she/he knows it is rationaly good decision to have it, not because she/he NEEDS to whatever the cost of fullfilling this desire.
.Also, show me an average guy who has a lot of sex and spreads std-s. It's often the argument of "but men do it too!".
Whats the point, do you want me to give you names, or something?
But well, I guess the women get STDs from masturbation in the first place, its not like they get it from.. men. Gross.
. One more thought: if it's only cultural, why have I felt it being gross for the majority of my life while living with pretty liberal friends?
You were not raised in a bubble. You are exposed to different opinions even if you was not raised strict.


I truly believe no one should be having sex as long as he thinks its gross/degrading for a woman. We can argue whether its good or bad, but if you truly feel like this, then you are a real asshole consciously making the women worse/gross for your own pleasures sake.
That's why I DON'T fuck women AND am looking for an asexual-ish girl to raise a family with. I feel kinda gross about my past experiences - even if I've rejected them and not gone further. I know what op feels.

Trust me, it really really sucks that I feel like that and I need to take steps to solve it. Nobody enjoys hating/being grossed out by something so major.
Last edited by MattsCrib on Mon Aug 31, 2020 10:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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MattsCrib
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Mon Aug 31, 2020 10:01 am

Lostcause wrote:
Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:54 am
. Genghis Khan and the vikings disagree
Not just them. What about the Romans and Greeks doing orgies on a regular basis? Or the medieval times and visiting brothels being common thing?
Its the recent times that did something gross and taboo from a sex.
We have a benefit of living in times of hygiene and medicine where we can recognize and treat stds, yet make no use of it, because we are still mentaly 100years behind, thinking its gross.
Taking examples from a culture who diddled kids and had orgies isn't that great imo. They were mentally fucked up according to basic human ethics. Shouldn't we thrive to be MORE systematic as a whole?

Like I said it's not a FULLY a cultural thing - it's not just that "evil patriarchy tells us that women can't be promiscuous".

It just IS icky, like spiders, blood, heights, rats etc. If anything the fact that you don't feel like that is cultural programming.

Like Andy said, it takes work to get over it. I hope both me and OP truly get over it.
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Mon Aug 31, 2020 10:50 am

I have to agree that historically, high-value men have always had concubines and multiple women. And it was just recently that religion has had a strong imposition on monogamy and such. Though I have to hand it to the last few hundred years where monogamy was strictly enforced, that society as a whole is more civilized. But deep down I think we all know that the natural order is that high-value men aim to scatter their seed, and young women are intrinsically driven to capture high-value seed from such men.

After some thinking and reading all the responses, I have decided to try to frame my mindset this way:

Everytime I have sex, I will do my best to frame it in a non-selfish way. I will try to teach them how to make me and men in general feel good, and I will do my best to encourage them to express themselves sexually. I will literally make the effort to at least make them learn something new when we engage sexually, and I will make damn sure she enjoys our time. I'll do my best that she be sexually satisfied with our time.

I just realized that even if the chick I scored with wasn't cute for my standards, I actually had this^ thought running in my head. Might sound basic to you guys, but this would be what I would try for the next few lays.
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Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:08 am

It just IS icky, like spiders, blood, heights, rats etc. If anything the fact that you don't feel like that is cultural programming.
I personaly think spiders and rats are cute (ok, the latter as long as they are clean), blood is whateva. Height scares me, but I feel like it scares me much more then everage person around me. The point is, if it's not cultural thing, but nature, then how am I not icky?
Other argument in that regard - isn't eating bugs icky? I mean, bugs are dirty and can be poisonous. They can be as dangerous as whatever thing you mentioned earlier. Nature has reasons for it to be universaly icky. Meanwhile some cultures eat bugs like it's whateva.
The point being - nature has it's way of making things icky, some come from our genes, some from culture. Culture is a way of nature of causing ickiness, yet it's flexible enough to adapt to reality we live in. So blaming your reaction on nature is an easy way to justify it, but think if doesn't come from your experiences in fact.
We aren't evolved for porn, hookups with 20, 30, 100 partners, condoms, birth control on a large scale level.
We are evolved to make as much children as we can, using as varied gene pool as we can. Which means as much sex as we can. Which means as many partners as we can - because it's a way of providing variety in a gene pool.
We are not evolved for birth control, but I do not thing it changes anything in the topic of discussion.
That's why I DON'T fuck women AND am looking for an asexual-ish girl to raise a family with. I feel kinda gross about my past experiences - even if I've rejected them and not gone further. I know what op feels.

Trust me, it really really sucks that I feel like that and I need to take steps to solve it. Nobody enjoys hating/being grossed out by something so major.
I feel like you being grossed out comes from the way you think, even tho you think it's nature that speaks through you. I am not psychologist, neither are you, but I have a feeling visiting one could help you fix it. Neither being grossed about what you did, neither being grossed to the point of wanting asexual relation for life sounds healthy to me. I mean - being asexual is fine, but it comes not from being asexual, but being grossed.
Taking examples from a culture who diddled kids and had orgies isn't that great imo. They were mentally fucked up according to basic human ethics. Shouldn't we thrive to be MORE systematic as a whole?
Yeah, they were. 1000 years from now we will be also considered a damned degenerates. That's the way society evolves. But answering your questions - yes, we should. And we do - we live in a times where we can more or less do casual sex without harming anyone. Let's make use of that.



Sorry if I am being a little aggresive in this discussion by the way, but the topic seems to trigger me a little. Because not only it's totally unfair and double standards, but also hurting men as a whole. What do I mean? Basicaly every single women I met was more concerned with playing not easy just because they knew, most men would treat them like shit if they thought they were having a lot of sex. Or even JUST sex. That's unhealthy both for women, and for men. It makes sex look like something bad and people end up grossed by it. Then armies of incels roam internet spreading hate on women, because they get no sex and the wheel closes.
Everytime I have sex, I will do my best to frame it in a non-selfish way. I will try to teach them how to make me and men in general feel good, and I will do my best to encourage them to express themselves sexually. I will literally make the effort to at least make them learn something new when we engage sexually, and I will make damn sure she enjoys our time. I'll do my best that she be sexually satisfied with our time.
Make every person you sleep with a better person. It sounds like something Andy would say.
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Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:32 am

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Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:45 am

Lostcause wrote:
Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:08 am
It just IS icky, like spiders, blood, heights, rats etc. If anything the fact that you don't feel like that is cultural programming.
I personaly think spiders and rats are cute (ok, the latter as long as they are clean), blood is whateva. Height scares me, but I feel like it scares me much more then everage person around me. The point is, if it's not cultural thing, but nature, then how am I not icky?
Other argument in that regard - isn't eating bugs icky? I mean, bugs are dirty and can be poisonous. They can be as dangerous as whatever thing you mentioned earlier. Nature has reasons for it to be universaly icky. Meanwhile some cultures eat bugs like it's whateva.
The point being - nature has it's way of making things icky, some come from our genes, some from culture. Culture is a way of nature of causing ickiness, yet it's flexible enough to adapt to reality we live in. So blaming your reaction on nature is an easy way to justify it, but think if doesn't come from your experiences in fact.
We aren't evolved for porn, hookups with 20, 30, 100 partners, condoms, birth control on a large scale level.
We are evolved to make as much children as we can, using as varied gene pool as we can. Which means as much sex as we can. Which means as many partners as we can - because it's a way of providing variety in a gene pool.
We are not evolved for birth control, but I do not thing it changes anything in the topic of discussion.
That's why I DON'T fuck women AND am looking for an asexual-ish girl to raise a family with. I feel kinda gross about my past experiences - even if I've rejected them and not gone further. I know what op feels.

Trust me, it really really sucks that I feel like that and I need to take steps to solve it. Nobody enjoys hating/being grossed out by something so major.
I feel like you being grossed out comes from the way you think, even tho you think it's nature that speaks through you. I am not psychologist, neither are you, but I have a feeling visiting one could help you fix it. Neither being grossed about what you did, neither being grossed to the point of wanting asexual relation for life sounds healthy to me. I mean - being asexual is fine, but it comes not from being asexual, but being grossed.
Taking examples from a culture who diddled kids and had orgies isn't that great imo. They were mentally fucked up according to basic human ethics. Shouldn't we thrive to be MORE systematic as a whole?
Yeah, they were. 1000 years from now we will be also considered a damned degenerates. That's the way society evolves. But answering your questions - yes, we should. And we do - we live in a times where we can more or less do casual sex without harming anyone. Let's make use of that.



Sorry if I am being a little aggresive in this discussion by the way, but the topic seems to trigger me a little. Because not only it's totally unfair and double standards, but also hurting men as a whole. What do I mean? Basicaly every single women I met was more concerned with playing not easy just because they knew, most men would treat them like shit if they thought they were having a lot of sex. Or even JUST sex. That's unhealthy both for women, and for men. It makes sex look like something bad and people end up grossed by it. Then armies of incels roam internet spreading hate on women, because they get no sex and the wheel closes.
Everytime I have sex, I will do my best to frame it in a non-selfish way. I will try to teach them how to make me and men in general feel good, and I will do my best to encourage them to express themselves sexually. I will literally make the effort to at least make them learn something new when we engage sexually, and I will make damn sure she enjoys our time. I'll do my best that she be sexually satisfied with our time.
Make every person you sleep with a better person. It sounds like something Andy would say.
No you're not being aggressive at all. I DO probably need therapy for a lot of things :D

The thing about being evolved to fuck as much as we can - it sucks just personally for me, because I truly haven't felt that way. I like a girl every 3-5 years, so I am shocked to find out that you guys want to have so many girls (and also girls) - it makes me feel like "just a stick to be ridden on" while I've always wanted to have 1, maybe 2 partners for life not because "Jesus told me so", but because I literally find attractive girls RARE. I get triggered by the pua stuff, where they say that "how many beautiful girls have you seen this month? Chances are many, but you were afraid..." etc. Hell nah! I find beautiful girls rare as fuck! My friends have told me that a 9 for them is a 6 for me - I agree, I just don't find girls attractive enough and it really hurts my soul to feel that girls, compared to me, have so low standards that they already have so many partners.

My want for an asexual partner truly does come from disgust.

A lot of the anger comes from not understanding how other people can NOT want a monogamous relationship with one rare person and how can they be so, so horny :/ it's just lonely, man.
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Mon Aug 31, 2020 4:26 pm

All the time most of you guys spent replying and trying to rationalize decisions you already made on an emotional level....

...is time you could have spent working on yourself and finding answers via experience, not mental wanka-wanka-bation.
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Tue Sep 01, 2020 1:50 am

Lostcause wrote:
Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:08 am
Because not only it's totally unfair and double standards, but also hurting men as a whole. What do I mean? Basicaly every single women I met was more concerned with playing not easy just because they knew, most men would treat them like shit if they thought they were having a lot of sex. Or even JUST sex. That's unhealthy both for women, and for men. It makes sex look like something bad and people end up grossed by it. Then armies of incels roam internet spreading hate on women, because they get no sex and the wheel closes.
Oh now this I will keep in mind. I just created this topic because I really want to get off this toxic mindset I just realized is subconsciously affecting me. I really, really do not want to judge women for being slutty, because moth men and women are also experimenting shit to see how this sex thing works. It is just such a sick double standard to allow men to have experience and women to be shamed for having experience (had this talk with the girl who gave me a BJ. May have also played as a factor as to why she sucked my dick).
Lostcause wrote:
Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:08 am
Make every person you sleep with a better person. It sounds like something Andy would say.
Yeah, now that I think about it. @KillYourInnerLoser was the first person to at least show that getting laid can be a self-improvement experience for both you and the girl you're getting laid with. That was what drew me deep here in GLL and KYIL.
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