colgate - first instadate of the year!!!

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colgate
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Fri Jan 14, 2022 8:15 pm

Ed_ wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:47 am
colgate wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 2:36 pm
Otherwise, I probably pushed most girls on average 3-5x for an instadate before getting bored and walking away without saying anything. Some girls I pushed at least 8x if they didn’t seem lame as fuck and then went for exchange. Hardly pushed any exchanges because it’s like, okay if you’re going to decline the instadate repeatedly *and* also decline my exchange, then you’re just lame, see ya
I see you mention this "pushing" a lot. Maybe it's just my experience, but almost all the sex I've had had required very little "pushing" to overcome resistance from the women I've been with. At most, if a girl rejects my invitation back to my place, then I bounce to another venue and try again. After a second rejection I end the date.

Maybe I'm missing out on tons of sex that I could be getting if I pushed my rejections harder, but it doesn't feel like it.

I don't remember reading anything from GLL or Andy that says "not enough pushing" is the reason a guy isn't getting laid. In fact it feels like the opposite, I know Andy has mentioned this article before:
Let me ask again: Why would you ever be excited to be with someone who is not excited to be with you? If they’re not happy with you now, what makes you think they’ll be happy to be with you later? Why do you make an effort to convince someone to date you when they make no effort to convince you?
https://markmanson.net/fuck-yes
I elucidated on what "pushing" entailed in my previous log. Also it ends up being on the same line of reasoning as "solving the girl's problem" as @KillYourInnerLoser has mentioned on his podcast, since it's not necessarily spamming, rather assuming the girl wants to continue the interaction and trying to veer the trajectory of the interaction in that direction. At least in my head anyway, but it's the first time I've really done this style.

Also, I've realized the same as you about "fuck yes or no", which is why I stopped taking a lot of contacts and walking away from girls who seemed like they didn't want to meet again at all (lots of excuses, etc).

Yeah, by all means maybe what I'm doing right now is actually not even worth the effort, but I've found few "fuck yes" girls so far. Also I've often seen girls initially act "fuck yes" and then devolve down to uhhh...idk...i can't....etc (so basically no). I have a lot of conflicting data points on not "pushing" past 2x because pushing past 2x implies unreceptiveness. Certainly the percentage of girls who would actually convert over from hyper-pushiness is quite low, but it's certainly not zero. And I don't feel I have anything to lose with the girl so I haven't found a reason not to experiment with this. I think the best example of the more "pushy" style actually working on the forums is @Manganiello's cold approach lay in Toronto.

The general trend I have observed is that guys who say don't bother with trying to be pushy and just focus on finding the "fuck yes" girls tend to have an abundance of the "fuck yes" girls. So of course it makes sense not to waste your time with being pushy. On the other hand, I've seen other guys convert quite a bit from being pushy, far more than I am. Given these data points, you could theoretically optimize in both directions for results (in other words, figure out how to increase the amount of girls you meet to say "fuck yes" to you and be sufficiently pushy with girls whom you perceive as "on the fence").

But that begs the question, how do you increase the percentage of "fuck yes" girls towards you? I'm genuinely curious and would like to know.

EDIT:
Read the Mark Manson article you've linked since it answers my question. Yeah, it's definitely self-improvement. I'm pretty aware of that also. Not saying this from any kind of adversarial point of view, as I've identified many things I need to work on about myself outside of specifically dating which would improve my dating. I think I tend to talk about those often on my log here. It's also something Troy and I have talked about at length in Austin. I have a bucket list of things I need to work on and much more to think about regarding myself and turning into a guy more girls my type want to date (haven't written logs about it here yet, probably will in the future). But thanks for reminding me about it again so I keep it in mind.
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Fri Jan 14, 2022 10:43 pm

colgate wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 8:15 pm
I have a bucket list of things I need to work
Like what?
I know bulking is one of them.
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Sat Jan 15, 2022 4:03 am

Manganiello wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 10:43 pm
Like what?
I know bulking is one of them.
Going to pull a Chris from GLL and just stream-of-consciousness list anything I can think of over a couple minutes in rapid-fire succession like he did here: https://www.goodlookingloser.com/laid/i ... our-demons

Bulking, having a structured routine, working on being socially aware + developing better empathy, not being overly eager, having a more masculine way of speaking, being someone who can defend myself and others, having a sexual vibe, competition anxiety, staying engaged in a process

Won't go into too much detail on any of these specifically yet because they usually end up unfolding as my life progresses, and I'm not a fan of "listing all my goals out" ahead of time because it's never really worked for me.

Main thing I need to focus on after this week is putting myself in the right environment to continue my self-improvement/dating progress over a more sustained period of time instead of just darting around the country (I've moved twice in the past 4 months), and I've realized that destroys any sense of basic structure for self-improvement, since it involves getting there + settling down + setting up your life again. If I were to have been in Nashville still up until this point with an unburnable college campus (or other place with high approach volume) I probably would have had much faster progress than I have had so far. Back in Nashville I was doing great with the gym+bulking too because I had it down to a routine. Moment I left Nashville that basically fell apart, and by the time I got back into it, I decided to move again (hence why my bulking log has been dormant again).
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Sat Jan 15, 2022 9:21 pm

The universe has given you an abundance. You need to push all the other puppies in the litter aside and suck all of the milk from the teat. Doesn't matter if you're the smallest, weakest, ugliest, whatever puppy. You drink all the milk, you'll be the biggest and the best.

The above was from some motivational video a guy showed us pregaming in his hotel room and it really stuck with me.

Daygame
Thursday 1/13:
Roughly 45 approaches over 2.5 hours. Again, just totally guessing because I lost track after like 7 tops once the volume started getting high. Mix of high and low volume. Good amount of instant deflections (confidently says I have boyfriend, not interested, etc) unlike Wednesday, including girl I literally made direct eye contact with and stared at after walking away from a previous girl during high volume who was instantly "not interested" without me even approaching her. Like, yeah exactly.

3 intentional reapproaches, including Japanese girl I went on date with Wednesday. These were girls I'd already exchanged with who had ghosted me up until that point. Just "hey, what's up" for the most part and then pushing for ID + probing logistics for regular date again like any other approach.

0 instadates. Same deal as last time. Pushed 3-5x for it over short convo. If girl was off to class, I would have some kind of extended conversation and had many that lasted over 5+ minutes. Mainly had extended conversations because I wanted to gauge whether I thought the girl was cool or lame. I actually walked away from one girl who kept making busy excuses for future plans despite talking to her for a while. Basically in general if girl seemed lame, I'd walk away without bothering to exchange as usual.

5 numbers, 3 snapchats. Just winged it if I wanted to grab number or snap. If girl was in a hurry or something, usually grabbed snap since it's quicker to scan her QR code than stand there and type her number in. I noticed with my limited data set I was actually chatting with more of the girls I've exchanged snaps with, so I think snap vs number doesn't actually matter much, especially since I think younger girls just think snapchat is a messaging platform. Just exchange any form of contact as you please. Doesn't matter because you'll likely get ghosted/excuses at the same rate. It's just a numbers game and eventually one will hit and she'll meet up. What's also interesting is despite me picking up almost triple the amount of contacts yesterday as I did today, I got ghosted by nearly all of my contacts yesterday, while most of my contacts today responded and we're chatting. It's almost random.

I want to make a quick point about rejection. After probably ~1100 lifetime daygame approaches so far, I've ended up unintentionally reframing "getting rejected" as "this girl is making excuses and is lame". Like, I've inverted the paradigm. I don't even see "rejection as mileage" necessarily anymore. It's just, most girls are lame as fuck, but occasionally you'll find some cool girl you vibe with whom you'd actually want to continue an interaction with. That's why I've been able to walk away from many girls without bothering to take their contact, I'm like, what's the point. I don't even like this specific girl now and there's plenty of other girls I'd rather talk to. I'm acting as I please and if the girl doesn't like it, there's another girl who will like it. This isn't to say I should not improve myself and my personality should be static, but rather, I'm not trying to get the girl to like me. I'm seeing if I like the girl beyond her appearance.

Date
second date + pull + no hookup
Second date with Japanese girl from Wednesday. I don't think I've had a second date with a girl since like my 2nd-3rd lifetime approach ever back in September so that's interesting. We met Friday afternoon for some pho. Didn't need to seed pull as we'd already agreed to come back to my place after, so it was just "let's go" after 30 minutes or so.

I hadn't really made much physical contact with her yet so I decided to do hyper-beta thing of "hey let me show you how to skateboard" since we'd talked about that. So I had her balance and try to push herself off of my longboard and kinda made sure she didn't fall. That lasted probably around 5 minutes.

She had already said she had to go at 5pm to do more homework and we arrived at my place around 4:15. I was aware of the time constraint I had.

She came in my room and I locked the door. Sat on edge of my bed but refused to take off shoes or mask. It's like, I'm the only other person here but let's leave the mask on. Anyway, she kind of came here under the premise of "me teaching her how to use hellotalk" from our first date, so she immediately pulled out her phone and started talking about it. We talked about it for like 25+ minutes and I was mentally jamming myself trying to get her to sit farther back on bed or try to escalate in some way, while also engaging in a conversation. That was my main fuckup, I started the pull too long with chatting, rather than engaging in an activity where we could chill in silence. Maybe I should have talked about it for 2 minutes tops and then I would have had more time. Also I should have just sat farther back on bed where I wanted to and kept my frame instead of trying to sit near her, perhaps.

Anyway, when I finally realized what was happening, I switched the activity to listening to music. Girl still wouldn't come farther back so I sat next to her and like immediately put my arm around her. But it was too late because it was already around 4:45pm. I tried just pulling her mask down and she was like "no! no! no!" and then said she had to go do her homework. I was afraid of causing a big scene in my room since this is an AirBNB with 3 other people so I didn't push anything (I didn't realize there would be other people staying here before I booked the place). Walked her outside my place, tried to pull down mask again, same "no! no! no!" so I just walked back into my place without saying anything.

Usually I escalate within 2-5 minutes but that's because we're doing some activity that involves chilling in silence (like listening to music). But I learned that if we're doing something that involves chatting about something at my place, I won't be able to escalate because I'll mentally jam myself. On first date, I was just trying every possible scheme I could come up with to get her back at my place, without that awareness. But next time, I'll be wary of that, just make sure it's something that's not chatting a bunch at my place, and if it is, transitioning out of that as quickly as possible.

Nightgame
I met up with a bunch of guys from another group I'm in and also @lacroix once again for a nightgame session last night.

Tempe is great for nightgame, it's probably my favorite place I've been to so far for night. Great vibes and extremely high volume on the weekend (though low volume during the week). I highly recommend visiting for a weekend if you're into nightgame. Lots of cool games, great music, and girls are cute af.

Did probably around 15-20 approaches total last night. I winged one guy named Rick from the group who's extremely good at nightgame. Rick tends to have a lot of cool novelty items to interact with girls with, such as weed glasses, fuzzy scarf, and harmonica. It's a viable strategy for nightgame especially if you aren't already super jacked/sexual yet to open girls. I've come to understand over roughly lifetime ~300 night approaches that literally saying a single word to a girl at night means you're hitting on her. So you can say anything you want, just make the approach and get shit happening. For a girl at night, she doesn't care about being complimented, she's out to have fun. So a value you could immediately provide to the girl is fun, and then you can just escalate from there.

Got a bunch of instant deflections, which was standard and good. Also some conversations/dancing here and there.

At some point, Rick was showing off his skill at the boxing game where you try to punch this bag as hard as possible. Rick's not jacked or muscular at all, he looks more like Michael Phelps, quite lanky. But he does jiu jitsu professionally, and figured out the technique for this specific boxing game and gets around 800+/1000, beating many guys who look beefier and stockier than he.

I had never tried this boxing game in my life, so I gave it a shot. Gave it a punch but I think I kind of missed the bag and literally got 1 out of 1000. Literally the lowest possible score. At this point my brain went into overdrive. I was thinking about the video Rick showed us during the pregame about how you need to push all the other puppies aside and suck all the milk from the teat. If anything, I need to do that more than anyone else. So I got to work.

Immediately after, I literally just opened some girl with like "holy shit!!!! I got a freaking 1 on that boxing game, look!!! what the fuck hahahaha!" Chatted with the group, occasional hints of trying to shoo me away, but I just kept talking with them and acting as I pleased. There were a bunch of friends meeting up with this girl so I just introduced myself to each girl, as if I already belonged there. Some girl was sharing her Ritz crackers with me lol. Eventually this whole thing kinda disbanded and I did some more approaching around the dance area.

At some point I eventually had Rick's scarf, so I started incorporating that into getting girls to dance with me. Like putting the scarf over them and dancing with a bunch of them. I found that I got a good amount of girls to dance for a little bit and grabbed some asses here and there.

There was one duo with a tall white chick and a hot af half asian chick who was slightly taller than I (probably 5'8", i was 5'6.5" maybe with my boots) hanging out by the bar. Hot af, so I approached with scarf dance. Some brief dancing, but she kept trying to make excuses to get me to go away, and the friend did the same. I just kept telling myself "No, Fuck this" over and over. I want this. Some other guy even approached the white girl and started talking to both of them. I was so pissed, like "No, Fuck this" again. Managed to separate the half asian girl from the white chick and kept dancing with her. Twirled her around a bunch and got pretty close. Friend kept trying to pull her away, straight up ignored her and kept dancing. I just kept pushing like an asshole. Eventually went for a kiss and we started making out a bunch. Girl kept making excuses that she had to go, and I straight up ignored her and kept doing what I wanted. Madeout again. I tried to isolate her away from friend like "let's go to the first floor" and she made even more excuses and wouldn't budge despite me repeatedly pushing. I probably should have just taken her and probably could have even just spammed "just 5 minutes, just 5 minutes" but I didn't think to do that. Finally just decided to exchange snap with her and go approach some more girls.

Scarf-dance approached some other girls, couldn't get very far with any of them. Then I ran into the half asian chick whom I made out with prior maybe 5-10 minutes later. Was straight up like "I thought you were leaving." She's like "yeah I am!". Anyway danced with her some more and repeatedly pushed isolating her but wouldn't budge again. Madeout some more. Eventually I left again without saying anything.

Literally had sensory overload shortly after this and had to call it a night from there. Like, not necessarily from the music and lights (although that may have exacerbated it), but rather how much shit has changed for me over my week so far in Phoenix and I had to try to process it so I couldn't continue approaching even though there was still mad volume.

This chick was probably the hottest chick I've made out with, I think 6th kiss of my whole life? Like wing-eye makeup and super cute. Also I came to a realization that it doesn't mean jack shit, just as much as grabbing her contact doesn't mean jack shit. She kept acting the same and being lame with making excuses even though I managed to escalate up to making out multiple times, a first for me at night from an approach, and I only had 2/3 of a shot of alcohol the whole night. Reason I just kept pushing is because she was so hot and I really wanted it. I probably pushed for what I wanted in some way over 25x throughout our interactions. You just have to keep pushing the interaction as much as possible and then if she still won't budge, just go approach others.
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Sat Jan 15, 2022 9:43 pm

colgate wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 9:21 pm
After probably ~1100 lifetime daygame approaches so far, I've ended up unintentionally reframing "getting rejected" as "this girl is making excuses and is lame"
Value here. My exact thoughts. When I leave after pushing for ID, I don't feel that I got rejected or did something wrong. I feel grateful because I didn't waste time with a lame chick.
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Sat Jan 15, 2022 10:11 pm

Smashing it with those approach blitzes my man. 1100 is a great number to learn a LOT. Your mindset optimises over-time (or at least it should).
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colgate
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Sun Jan 16, 2022 12:35 pm

Nightgame
Maybe 30+ approaches, 20+ instant deflections. Some conversations and dancing, but girls ran away before I managed to escalate. Dunno if I was too slow or just mostly lame girls.

Rick messaged our group chat at some point that he pulled+fooled around with this chick. He was like, anyone who potentially wants a threesome come find me. I was like, shit okay and decided to look for them. Literally went up to his hotel room at first but they weren't there. Later ran into them in line.

I decided to just hang around and see what would happen. Rick ended up telling this girl to makeout with me. So we did. She was like 5'9" and white. Then Rick was like "I gotta get this on snap/video!" so we madeout again.

I'm really glad I got to makeout with that hot half asian chick last night because I made that happen all on my own. And it made this one feel like "lol whatever okay who cares" since it was literally just given to me.

Honestly, her personality was kind of grating and she was acting ultra masculine. Reminded me of many chicks in Austin whom I met around my apartment.

We were trying to hook her up with @lacroix so we went up to his hotel room. She also "chose" another guy from the group whom she wanted to hook up with, and we ran into that guy later, and he came with us. Plan was to just leave them in hotel room with lacroix, and then Rick and I would bounce.

So we did that, and then later even lacroix was somehow super turned off by her as well so he left shortly after. She ended up hooking up with the other guy, and some other guy in a threesome. Then later she hooked up with yet another guy in our group.

Before I started going balls to the wall with dating, I was kind of like "omg kissing, wow!" But now I've kind of been seeing it as just some other escalation step. Like it's not a huge deal anymore. It does really get me aroused though and puts me in the mood with a girl though.

Anyway, leaving Phoenix tomorrow. Will be taking time off from focusing on dating for a while to catch up on work and sort out an environment where I can better make sustained progress over a longer period of time instead of just darting around the country. I really like Phoenix though and would consider visiting here in the distant future, it even seems like a great place to live.

ps: I got 846 on the punching game today. Way more proud of that, as I literally got 1 yesterday. Took me a couple rounds of getting 700+ but I finally got a decent score. Also I think I may have pulled my bicep doing another round after the 846 haha.
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Sun Jan 16, 2022 1:20 pm

colgate wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 12:35 pm
Rick messaged our group chat at some point that he pulled+fooled around with this chick. He was like, anyone who potentially wants a threesome come find me.
You guys are into some crazy shit :D Having a devil threesome is something I am still not sure whether I want to try it. Some part of me finds it very intriguing, another part of me is disgusted.

"push other puppies aside, suck all universe's milk"

I like your motto. Fuck the sheep!
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Sun Jan 16, 2022 2:52 pm

Man it sounds awesome as fuck over there.

Who was the other guy?
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Mon Jan 17, 2022 9:38 am

colgate wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 2:36 pm
I decided to just hang around and see what would happen. Rick ended up telling this girl to makeout with me. So we did. She was like 5'9" and white. Then Rick was like "I gotta get this on snap/video!" so we madeout again.
So I've learned that this chick was in 10+ pornos. I guess I can say I've madeout with a pornstar now. Make of that what you will lol.
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Wed Jan 19, 2022 4:27 am

colgate wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 12:35 pm
Honestly, her personality was kind of grating and she was acting ultra masculine. Reminded me of many chicks in Austin whom I met around my apartment.

We were trying to hook her up with @lacroix so we went up to his hotel room. She also "chose" another guy from the group whom she wanted to hook up with, and we ran into that guy later, and he came with us. Plan was to just leave them in hotel room with lacroix, and then Rick and I would bounce.

So we did that, and then later even lacroix was somehow super turned off by her as well so he left shortly after. She ended up hooking up with the other guy, and some other guy in a threesome. Then later she hooked up with yet another guy in our group.

Before I started going balls to the wall with dating, I was kind of like "omg kissing, wow!" But now I've kind of been seeing it as just some other escalation step. Like it's not a huge deal anymore. It does really get me aroused though and puts me in the mood with a girl though.

Anyway, leaving Phoenix tomorrow. Will be taking time off from focusing on dating for a while to catch up on work and sort out an environment where I can better make sustained progress over a longer period of time instead of just darting around the country. I really like Phoenix though and would consider visiting here in the distant future, it even seems like a great place to live.
She was an interesting character. Not my type but I envy her shamelessness, screwing a bunch of guys in a group and giving exactly zero fucks.

Tempe was really cool. The students are lots of fun. Assuming the surrounding areas hold up too it would probably be a great place to live.

In only a few days you got some dates/kissing in, which is awesome. If you lived there longer you'd definitely have some really cool shit happen.
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colgate
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Mon Jan 24, 2022 3:05 am

I literally was schizzing out at my parents' place from not being able to approach so I booked an AirBNB in San Jose for a week. I'm going to keep staying here for maybe a month until I get my future plans sorted out.

Strolled around getting a huge nostalgia blast though it's Sunday so no volume. Still couldn't resist approaching. I'm here because the realization that I can go up to nearly any girl and try to start something is irreversible and after how much shit happened to me in Phoenix last week, I can't not approach and stop dating. It felt like I unplugged a turbine on full blast for no reason so rather than sitting around trying to sort a long-term solution all day, I decided to come here in the interim.

I also spent some time reading @Suave1's log as he had some success with approach on a campus. It's quite different than what I've been exposed to but doing approach blitzes on a campus means burning it down quickly and getting banned/blackballed (iow, even if you don't get explicitly banned, if all the girls know you're talking to them, I think you basically become notorious and none of the girls will meet you. Similar thing happened to @pancakemouse from approaching too many Argentinian girls and they all told each other, effectively closing him off from many girls).

I think @Suave1's log has been brushed off under the radar in particular, mainly because he doesn't necessarily do "high volume approach", but I think more people should check it out. I say this because his log seems like what a normal guy on a campus would do if he wanted to hook up with girls at school, without reading a crazy amount of esoteric theory. He managed to get a couple hookups and a plate if I remember correctly last semester.

viewtopic.php?p=22824#p22824

Daygame
3 approaches. 1 instadate. 0 pull.

1 - Hot af asian with her mom. Literally couldn't not approach. Brief convo, and then they said they were in a rush and rejection on the contact exchange.
2 - Chick on skateboard, looked like hot white chick from Arizona. Except wasn't a chick. I said "yo", and then a deep male voice said "sorry?". Instantly ejected.
3 - I was sitting around chilling when a chick came over and sat down on a bench near me. She said "hi" to me. Then she meditated for like 10 minutes. I decided not to be a total asshole and control myself until she finished her round of meditation. Then I just went up and said "hey, I'm colgate". She ecstatically told me her name, and then I just asked her if she wanted to grab some boba tea. Agreed, and she wouldn't stop talking. She's some divorced yoga chick who was talking about how we're "living in multiple layers of simulations." Also talked about how "we should embrace life and take risks and explore" blah blah. Anyway, I went for the pull after 15-20 minutes after I finished my tea. Declined. Let's decline "taking the risk" of going back to random guy's place. Talked for another 20ish minutes and walked around. I went for the pull again 2x after that and she declined again, so we just exchanged.
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5'5" indian in 🇺🇸→🇯🇵, childhood in religious cult, turned teenage internet gay, now aspiring toxic male.
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pancakemouse
Posts: 1769 | Thanks: 1053
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2021 4:14 pm
Goal: Master cold approach
Age: 33

Mon Jan 24, 2022 3:12 am

Oh god, Man Jose. I'm so, so sorry.

Wait, you love Asian chicks.

OK, fine, you'll be in heaven.

At least every other guy is weak there, so it's not like you'll have to deal with competition.
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colgate
Posts: 919 | Thanks: 1775
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 2021 9:23 pm
Name: bulldog
Goal: BANG!! japanese chicks!
Age: 27
Location: japan
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Mon Jan 24, 2022 4:45 am

colgate wrote:
Mon Jan 24, 2022 3:05 am
Oh god, Man Jose. I'm so, so sorry.
If you go out to the suburbs or the tech complexes, yeah lol.

But the gender ratio at the uni is 51.3% female. Besides it doesn't matter because I remember being here years ago never approaching the swarms of hot college girls.

I guess I *will* use this reply to talk about two times I tried to "approach" girls while at uni, just completely organically.

1 - Random asian girl sitting by herself eating. I just went up and asked if I could eat with her. 30+ minute chat, I never bothered asking for her contact information.
2 - Japanese girl I overheard speaking Japanese. Just went up to her and said I'm learning Japanese (in Japanese) and exchanged LINE. Met up for Ethiopian food some days later. Then she blocked me on LINE.
💁🏽‍♂️🐶
5'5" indian in 🇺🇸→🇯🇵, childhood in religious cult, turned teenage internet gay, now aspiring toxic male.
📖 My Story

🥰 dating log
💪🏾 training log

see my interview!
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