colgate - the renaissance of the BROWN SHOGUN...

The main purpose of this forum; tell us what goals you're working on.
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colgate
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Tue Nov 30, 2021 6:21 pm

pancakemouse wrote:
Tue Nov 30, 2021 2:21 pm
I'm continually impressed at how self-reflective you are. It's a great trait.
I think since I beat AA by just making myself approach, I've literally treated the process of approaching girls itself to be my form of therapy and self-improvement. Yeah, you could go to a psychologist and try to break down your mental/emotional issues. Yeah, you can go to the gym and improve your style, hair, shoes, and muscles, and that'll definitely get you results and make you feel somewhat better (in addition to passing the looks threshold for more girls).
But the way I see it, each approach I make chips away at deep crystallized issues I've buried away for years, and at some point, yet another one gets exposed. Then I'm forced to confront it in order to continue and improve who I am. There are so many learned behaviors I have which I do without thinking which are detriments for my "game", and I have to discover and unlearn each of them, one at a time.
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Tue Nov 30, 2021 7:21 pm

colgate wrote:
Tue Nov 30, 2021 6:21 pm
But the way I see it, each approach I make chips away at deep crystallized issues I've buried away for years, and at some point, yet another one gets exposed. Then I'm forced to confront it in order to continue and improve who I am. There are so many learned behaviors I have which I do without thinking which are detriments for my "game", and I have to discover and unlearn each of them, one at a time.
This Process Will Strip You Down and Force You To Confront Your Real Issues
Current Goals:
✅ Lose virginity
✅ Have sex with the same girl a second time
✅ Overcome AA
✅ Get to 135 lbs with 10% bodyfat
✅ Have ongoing sex (fuck buddy) with a really hot girl
⚪ Find a hot girl and focus on having really high quality sex
⚪ Have a relaxed, carefree, youthful, open minded, ongoing relationship with a hot girl
⚪ Get to 140 lbs with 10% bodyfat

📸 Avatar credit to Bman

My log and Tinder photos thread
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Tue Nov 30, 2021 11:06 pm

Ed_ wrote:
Tue Nov 30, 2021 7:21 pm
colgate wrote:
Tue Nov 30, 2021 6:21 pm
But the way I see it, each approach I make chips away at deep crystallized issues I've buried away for years, and at some point, yet another one gets exposed. Then I'm forced to confront it in order to continue and improve who I am. There are so many learned behaviors I have which I do without thinking which are detriments for my "game", and I have to discover and unlearn each of them, one at a time.
This Process Will Strip You Down and Force You To Confront Your Real Issues
Just skimmed this article and damn. Fucking good shit. Super wise.
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Jacobpalmer123
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Wed Dec 01, 2021 8:55 pm

You and I have a similar issue. Cutting interactions short and just going for the sale. In my mind once I've made the sale I usually think its best to leave. But the sale is getting laid not the number, probably something I should consider. I'll try these longer approaches as I think word gets around about me and better to talk for awhile and feel the vibe out. I think like you I want to develop a frame as well. Its not talked about much on gll.

I like how introspective your log is. I think I should try to do that as well. But I'll be moving to Austin eventually hopefully sooner rather than later.
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colgate
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Thu Dec 02, 2021 12:11 am

pancakemouse wrote:
Tue Nov 30, 2021 2:21 pm
But the sale is getting laid not the numbe
Yeah, this was one of the most important realizations I made from approach. It's okay to come off as the guy who talks to a lot of girls but it's not okay to come off as the guy who just collects a bunch of numbers. You want to be as genuine as you can during a short chat to the girl so you're an actual person behind the number in her phone.
Contact exchange is secondary and incidental to the approach + interaction.
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Thu Dec 02, 2021 3:59 am

Where do you get your approaches in in Austin night and day?
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colgate
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Sat Dec 04, 2021 4:56 am

Daygame
Wednesday 12/01:
11#/25+, 0 ID
Applied what I said I was going to do in my last log with cutting back to 2-3 min convos, while zoning in on my "vibe", which was "guy who darts around the country and you're an attractive girl for the ride". Noticed a veritable change in my frame for every interaction. I can say this because I actively noticed several -BSU girls on my approaches for the first time. E.g. girl acts nervous and awkward when I open her, but I care zero and maintain the same energy throughout the conversation. These girls started gradually matching me and getting more energetic as I talked to them and went onto exchange. Conversely, I stopped unnecessarily showering +BSU girls in compliments when they reacted overly positive to my opener. Neither of these were deliberate actions or goals I tried to achieve, rather they were the results of maintaining my frame by not changing how I'm acting based on the girl. My openers were hyper-direct and I hallucinogenically saw myself drawing my bow with my "yo" and sometimes arm tap, waiting for them to have my undivided attention, and shooting them with "you're cute", "you're pretty", "you're adorable", "you're attractive", etc. Didn't stumble over my words at all. And I stopped trying to justify to girls why I'm there on the campus. Didn't profusely apologize to girls I jumpscared, just waited for them to calm down and level out before opening them. Probably one of my best approach sessions to date (extreme positive exchange tilt is just a coincidence btw). Only thing I need to keep myself in check for is not letting "solid frame" be an excuse to be hyper rigid and devolving into robotic approaches again.

Thursday 12/02:
3#/15 + 1 fake, 0 ID
Met up with @Ed_ again. It was fun to bounce ideas off of each other in between approaching. Also discovered some new places to approach thanks to him.
Only approach I really want to mention is this one, probably my favorite one of all time:

"Jumpscare" a girl when I walk up to her on the side and say "yo", wait for her to calm down, open, then she's like "omg you're so bold!". I continue to talk to her, and for each thing I tell her, she's like "omg you're so bold!". After like 45 seconds of talking she says "omg you're so bold! but i kinda have feelings for someone". The way she was saying it made me just want to continue interacting with her and push for like 4+ minutes (don't remember how many times). Literally for 4 minutes, everything she said was prefaced with "omg you're so bold". Eventually I got impatient and left and really regret not just taking her on an instadate by the hand or something. I literally don't know when I'll ever run into a girl like this again which is why I'm hitting myself for ejecting after 4 minutes.

https://v3.fastupload.co/file/10341 <-- audio because I captured exactly how she said "omg you're so bold"

Friday 12/03:
6#/35 + 2 fakes, 0 ID
Short morning session with @lacroix, was like 1#/15 + 2 fakes on campus. Also it was raining. Also I accidentally approached a guy who had wavy hair and earrings and called him pretty. I heard his voice and his name and I instantly ejected. Absolutely solid. You can never tell with these Asians. Maybe it made his day at least.
Later it stopped raining so I went out to the area Ed showed me yesterday and I honestly did more exploring than approaching because the volume was really low. Took me like 3 hours to do roughly 20 approaches (there were periods of medium traffic here and there, and then long periods of like 0 people). I need to figure out when this place has real volume.

Date
21yo american-born chinese, Thursday 9pm, bar. pull+no hookup.
I literally remembered zero about this girl before I met her at the bar, because my tag in my phone was totally non-descriptive with just her major and "text 2 weeks from now". She arrives 11 minutes early. Holy shit???? I arrive 4 minutes early after I see her text that she's arrived. I was guessing she was going to be Asian since I don't usually tag that in my phone. I see some cute Asian girl with glasses standing by herself watching people ride the mechanical bull with a drink. But I decided just to text where she was anyway and then she looks back and spots me. I go up to her and kind of side-hug her since she was kind of against the wall. We sit down and have a chat for 15 minutes. She's pretty receptive to my random physical screening such as periodically putting my arm over her. I decide to play Mario Kart arcade with her for a round just because I wanted to (this bar has arcade games).
Then I bounce to another bar (which was honestly unnecessary, but I just felt like it. next time I won't do this). I mentioned that one of my favorite drinks is gin and tonic and she's never tried it so I order one for her at the second bar. She takes like 30 minutes to finish it and I'm schizzing out (lol not really, I was fine, I just wanted to say I was schizzing out). More random chat, try to get her to dance a bit but she's not into it. Anyway, after she finally finishes her drink, I just walk out with her to my place and she follows me in no resistance. Then she immediately asks where the bathroom is. I'm like "lol fuck, I'm about to get trolled so hard right now". I fiddle with my computer on my bed in the meanwhile.

She walks out of the bathroom on the phone like "you want me to come over right now?" Yup, called it. She walks in my room and tells me she has an "emergency". I won't log the entire interaction but to summarize, she's like "my friend's boyfriend wants to kill himself and he shut off his phone" *gets on phone*
me: "your friend can't talk to him?"
her: *gets off phone* "no I'm the only person who can talk to him" *gets on phone*
me: "stay for 30 minutes and then go"
her: *gets off phone* "let me check" *gets on phone*
her: *gets off phone* "no i think i have to go right now" *gets on phone*

Probably could have just said "ok go", but I decided to walk her out and give her a ride back (it was like 5 minutes away so I didn't really care). She scurries out of my car as soon as we reach.

I don't really care whether this actually happened or if it was just A+ acting (she really did a good job), because either way it's an absolutely amusing troll. If it was real, then the universe trolled me. If it was an excuse, then it's just a standard troll. Things like this happens to guys all the time so it's mileage for me.

What's interesting is that if I somehow were in this situation 3+ months ago, or if it were my first date of my life, I probably would have been hyper-obsessed with this girl and the situation. But thanks to approach, I see it with clarity and care zero. It's like, alright.

Approach Anxiety: Socially Anxious vs. Socially Disconnected
Read this part of my log first about why some guys may see results with "fewer approaches" than others due to previous sexual experience: viewtopic.php?p=23887#p23887

Been contemplating why some guys will inherently have more trouble with approach anxiety than others. I think this journal might provide value to guys trying to figure out why they have to incessantly grind with sustained action to beat their approach anxiety for months, while they perhaps see others overcome it extremely quickly.

Mark Manson proposes two categories of guys in his book "Models": socially anxious and socially disconnected. I'll just post this passage:
Screen Shot 2021-12-03 at 10.07.02 PM.png
If tl;dr: Socially anxious guys are hyper-attuned to social norms and pay attention to the emotions of others, sometimes to the point of their own detriment. Socially disconnected guys are often "bold" and "fearless", but only because they are completely unaware/don't care about social norms, and often have trouble connecting with people.

These categories actually highlight why some guys will be able to get over approach anxiety in a relatively short time (e.g.: ~15 hours over a few days), while others can take months or maybe even years. Socially disconnected guys (like me), will have an inherent advantage to getting over approach anxiety, because most of their approach anxiety is mostly things like "I'm going to get kicked out of this place if I'm hitting on girls", "Do I have the right to talk to girls?". Any approach anxiety reasons related to how a specific girl might perceive the approach or otherwise non self-centered reasons are often shallower and are overcome relatively quickly, compared to the deep-rooted reasons. Once a socially disconnected guy overcomes his approach anxiety, he will often be doing approaches that many might perceive as audacious extremely early on (e.g. approach girl sitting at a table in a restaurant with 6 other people). But it should be clarified that it's not out of being inherently "ballsier", it's actually often out of being mostly oblivious to social norms and the emotions of the girl/surrounding people/situation he is in for those approaches. A brick wall socially disconnected guys will hit early on after getting over anxiety and getting their confidence up to where they want it is while they are "confident", they literally don't know what to do (extremely socially uncalibrated).

On the other hand, socially anxious guys will have a much harder time overcoming approach anxiety. I'm not socially anxious myself, but maybe other guys here who perceive themselves that way can chime in about their personal approach anxiety struggles (I would greatly appreciate it actually, since that would make this journal have even more value. Reply to this thread, and I'll edit them into this post. Most of what I'm writing here is how I've observed @lacroix during approach sessions). Since these guys are so hyper-aware of the surroundings and their perception of how the girls whom they want to talk to will judge the approach, there's objectively more baggage to overcome and power through, as opposed to socially disconnected guys. Additionally, they may also have a harder time maintaining frame and their approach interactions will probably be more wildly affected by the girl's reactions (e.g.: being absolutely enamored and "in love" with a hyper-receptive girl while simultaneously taking lots of rejections where they can't even get past "hi" because they *think* the girl is ignoring them and wants to be left alone, when often that may not be the case). Even when they get into approach, they will have a long road of ramping up to more "audacious" approaches (e.g.: can only hit on girls who are doing absolutely nothing, can't hit on a girl in a group, can't hit on a girl walking, etc)

Obviously the above categories are more of a gradient rather than two discrete categories.

A mindset I might be able to provide for socially anxious guys (this was also one thing @Ed_ and I were discussing on Thursday) is that 95%+ of the time, the girl is minding her own business and is completely "oblivious" to the surrounding environment that you've perceived to make approaching her "out of your place". Put more harshly, the universe doesn't care about you and neither does the girl. I say this from a positive perspective as it can potentially alleviate much of the emotional "responsibility" that socially anxious guys may put on themselves. You do your approach, and be firm about it, and then you can have an interaction with her and it'll be alright.
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Sat Dec 11, 2021 10:48 am

Where u at king colgate?
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Jacobpalmer123
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Sat Dec 11, 2021 5:56 pm

Honestly if a girl says that I'm just gonna say I have some one else coming over so its all good. Man approaching a dude, I think I've almost done that but I always try to do a little reconnaissance before I do anything. Like there was this tall blonde but then I heard them talking with their friend and realized it was a trans person. Dodged a bullet there. My buddy would say I'm socially unaware. But I think we are all a little bit of both just depends on which of the two you lean more into.

I've also noticed there are a lot of heavy women in my town. How is it in your town?
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colgate
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Sun Dec 12, 2021 1:44 am

Jacobpalmer123 wrote:
Sat Dec 11, 2021 5:56 pm
I've also noticed there are a lot of heavy women in my town. How is it in your town?
My old city had more heavy chicks and I basically "had" to approach them because there was no volume and I was working on "approach x chicks per day". In Nashville and Austin it's more balanced, but I'll approach them if I think they have a cute face or large boobs/ass.
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Sun Dec 12, 2021 3:22 am

colgate wrote:
Sat Dec 04, 2021 4:56 am
If tl;dr: Socially anxious guys are hyper-attuned to social norms and pay attention to the emotions of others, sometimes to the point of their own detriment.
Damn, this really hit home for me. This describes me completely and I hate it, I need to work on speaking without a filter (or much less of one). I'm gonna buy it anyway but what is your thoughts on the book?
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colgate
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Sun Dec 12, 2021 3:29 am

Striker wrote:
Sun Dec 12, 2021 3:22 am
colgate wrote:
Sat Dec 04, 2021 4:56 am
If tl;dr: Socially anxious guys are hyper-attuned to social norms and pay attention to the emotions of others, sometimes to the point of their own detriment.
Damn, this really hit home for me. This describes me completely and I hate it, I need to work on speaking without a filter (or much less of one). I'm gonna buy it anyway but what is your thoughts on the book?
I read it back in May when I hadn't started talking to girls, I need to re-read it now and I'll get back to you.
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Sun Dec 12, 2021 4:06 am

colgate wrote:
Sun Dec 12, 2021 3:29 am
Striker wrote:
Sun Dec 12, 2021 3:22 am


Damn, this really hit home for me. This describes me completely and I hate it, I need to work on speaking without a filter (or much less of one). I'm gonna buy it anyway but what is your thoughts on the book?
I read it back in May when I hadn't started talking to girls, I need to re-read it now and I'll get back to you.
I love that book. It's required reading in my bootcamp lol jk. Really is one of if not the best best thing I've read on "game" right next to Andy's tinder guide.
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colgate
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Sun Dec 12, 2021 7:50 am

Daygame
Monday 12/06:
4#/30, 0 ID
mileage highlight: went probably 1#/25 and then I ended up exchanging with 3 of the last 5 girls I approached.

Thursday 12/09:
1#/1
Not even a session, but I'll mention it because it was an interesting approach. Duo and I start chatting for a bit. The girls are like we're going to get ice cream. At first I was like "let's go together", and the girl I was talking to was like we're having a girls' night. But then her friend was like "omg no, go get ice cream with him". So we walked in, ordered ice creams, and the friend followed us. I invited Troy to come over and he started talking to the other girl. Then the four of us sat around outside chatting some more. I set up a date to meet with the girl I approached for Saturday 7pm (which she ended up cancelling) and we exchanged. Meanwhile, Troy was pushing for this other girl's number like 10x with various jokes such as "come on just give me a fake number so I can say I got it" (as an obvious joke). He was hugging and being hyper-physical with this other girl and all of us were laughing and having fun. Eventually we decided to leave and Troy was like "that girl is going to be thinking about me when she's fucking her boyfriend".

I was going to do more approaches but I ended up getting peer-pressured into taking some shots. Had way too many and came back out puking on the sidewalk while sitting on a bench. Couldn't even move my own body and had to be carried into the truck. Then I was over the toilet for like 2-3 hours. Definitely never doing that again loooool.

Friday 12/10:
3#/15, 0 ID
Met up with @Ed_ who showed me another new place to approach. This place has decent volume on the weekends and is pretty close to my place so I can do instadates.

Saturday 12/11:
5#/40, 1 ID, 0 pull.
Went back to the place I went to with Ed on the previous day and had a long day (3+ hours). Most girls I approached were probably older than 30. Thought I was going to have a massive zero day and then around the 15-20th approach I finally exchanged with someone who was doing postdoc at the uni. Alright lol.

I've come to understand that during approach sessions, it's hardly that you're getting rejected, most girls are just closed off. I realized that before I went out today so today couldn't have been a better day to start off with something like 0/15~20. You're merely searching for the girls who are interested in continued interaction. Just like how guys are probably 19/20 times down to derail their whole day to spend time with a girl, reciprocally girls are 19/20 times not down to throw away what they're doing to spend time with a guy. Imagine if even some fairly average girl came up to you like "wanna watch a movie at your place?" with no strings attached. Maybe 90%+ of the time you'd be like, is this a troll? Okay! I'll postpone all my work and other plans. So when approaching, you're looking for the <10% of girls who'd do the same for you.

Instadate was with someone who said she was leaving tomorrow and had to meet a friend later that night so I figured I had enough time. Went to a cupcake+coffee shop and chatted for maybe 20-25 minutes. Then we walked around for a bit. Tried to pull with "let's go ride scooters" (and scootering back to my neighborhood), but she was like "nooo my friend is picking me up and I came here to meet him". We went back and forth for about a minute until she was like "I'm going to walk this way" and then I ejected without exchanging (since she was literally leaving tomorrow). Honestly I could have pushed more.

Almost had a second instadate with a FOB Korean chick who was also visiting literally just today. We walked into a taco shop expecting to maybe get 1 taco each, but it ended up being this "gourmet" tex-mex place. I didn't want to waste a lot of time and money so I explained that you can't just get 1 taco here and that we should leave. She was like "is that okay?" and I said "yeah" and we just left. Then she says she has an "appointment" in half an hour.
me: "what appointment"
her: "a steak appointment"
Interesting choice of words, anyway I decided to tell her we can meet in like 2-3 hours for a drink downtown (because she said the steak restaurant was downtown). We exchanged and then she ghosted when I tried to confirm (text and then call 30 min after the text).

--

Will be going back to my town for a week so let's see if any of my contacts go anywhere after I get back.

I started to write some thoughts here but they're still not ripened yet. Relates to a lot of discussion I've had with Ed over the past week. Will hopefully have some brainblast and write a bit here over the next week.

I'll just link this podcast episode since it's relevant: https://theinnerwinnershow.com/157/
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Crisis_Overcomer
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Sun Dec 12, 2021 8:19 am

colgate wrote:
Sat Dec 04, 2021 4:56 am
On the other hand, socially anxious guys will have a much harder time overcoming approach anxiety. I'm not socially anxious myself, but maybe other guys here who perceive themselves that way can chime in about their personal approach anxiety struggles (I would greatly appreciate it actually, since that would make this journal have even more value. Reply to this thread, and I'll edit them into this post. Most of what I'm writing here is how I've observed @lacroix during approach sessions). Since these guys are so hyper-aware of the surroundings and their perception of how the girls whom they want to talk to will judge the approach, there's objectively more baggage to overcome and power through, as opposed to socially disconnected guys. Additionally, they may also have a harder time maintaining frame and their approach interactions will probably be more wildly affected by the girl's reactions (e.g.: being absolutely enamored and "in love" with a hyper-receptive girl while simultaneously taking lots of rejections where they can't even get past "hi" because they *think* the girl is ignoring them and wants to be left alone, when often that may not be the case). Even when they get into approach, they will have a long road of ramping up to more "audacious" approaches (e.g.: can only hit on girls who are doing absolutely nothing, can't hit on a girl in a group, can't hit on a girl walking, etc)
Oh man that's so me, it's not even funny.

First, if I skip a few days of approaching it really fucks me up. My social momentum/audacity falls to zero and struggle to hit on girls again.

Then, even if I warm up, it also takes me some time to stop caring about the "environment". There are times where I see a girl I want to approach, but I'll also see someone else around and this will make me skip the approach. The other person can be doing whatever. They could be looking the other way, staring in the distance. They can be 10 feet behind or in front of the girl. Whatever. There's no rhyme or reason for those cases, I just can't approach. My worst place is the main shopping street in Athens. I could hit on 3-5 girls per minute there (180-300 hard deflections per hour, Jesus) but there are sooo many people around that I just freeze.

I can't tell you for sure about frame since I think it's mainly a PUA term and I don't have much experience.

I also struggle with audacious approaches. Basically, I don't struggle, I just don't do them. Ever. Hitting on a girl in a duo is a no-no for me. My brain comes up with lots of rationalizations but I know it's just a way to protect my ego.

Another thing: when I'm daydreaming, I imagine myself debating people about things I'm doing and coming up with amazing arguments that shut them up. So, even when I'm goofing around, I'm still trying to protect some of the choices I've been making for years (being self employed, picking polygamy, approaching girls, choosing not to travel, painting my nails more recently etc).

Finally, the biggest frustration in me is discovering how compartmentalized the entire game is...and how variable my performance is in each section.

For example, I had no problem physically screening girls when I first discovered the term. I think I went all the way from holding hands to kissing super fast on my 2nd or 3rd girl. This came naturally to me. But with approaching it's a struggle.

In fact, while writing this, I had an aha moment: For me, the struggle has nothing to do with the girl. If it had, I wouldn't physically escalate with girls I've known for 1 minute and I would be afrai to invite them home 25-30 minutes into the date. What fucks me up is the environment or, "what would others think". Moving forward I should laser focus on a girl I want to approach and don't even look at others. I actually do it sometimes involuntarily when I think I'll skip the approach and it helps me.

Damn, thanks for this man.

lemme know if there are any spots in your bootcamp
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