Rice photo log

[kratjeuh]

Though I will say in general, girls have always still been into me once we meet in person. I've always used faceapp heavily. Except for like 1-2 times where she was half a head taller than me. But that could very well have been bad in person game as well

Do you mind sharing just how heavily you faceapp (maybe I do too little)?

Also are you aware of the no makeup filter? This one usually just removes extensive shiny skin which is the biggest catfish giveaway

[Lusty69]

Hey dude, Awesome log and congratulations for getting out there.

Just wanted to share from a 5'3.5" short fat kid. Daygame is your friend if you want quality is what I found over my years, been doing pick up for 12 years but spent about 6 years of that in relationships and the first year or so not really taking it seriously, along with 1 other year off with injuries so actively going out for maybe 4 years.

My advice is don't see yourself as an incel, my mindset was always like I know this pick up stuff so I can hack the system of what society says I should be or whatever the norms are. I guess then all I did was work harder than anyone else especially when I started out and I was learning. If you have only done 400 approaches and gotten 14 lays you are doing well.

It took me close to 1000 approaches to get my first lay when I was 18 and a complete utter loser retard who finished school with no friends and no social skills, I learned social skills through cold approach, actually daygame has to be one of the biggest hacks for public speaking and networking skills I have carried over to business success now.

With the face app stuff, I heavily face apped and did headshots only the last time I did a run online dating, I had maybe half the girls go that I catfished them, the other half I made super horny they didn't care, and the ones that catfished my back that I decided to sleep with stayed around much longer, but I did a steak of about 1 new girl per week after doing about 2-3 dates per week which took me Bumble, Hinge daily swiping.

Big take away for me is that online dating will always yield lower quality as I never have had that great of photos but I would say my text game and everything else is very on point after all the years.

For you, you are doing really fucking well, up the daygame, and wear some height increasing shoes if you go out at night, most girls wear heels so when you both take your shoes off they are shorter than you or don't notice or care, the hottest girl I pulled from nightgame was this fitness model back ages ago from night game with fake tits who had flat shoes and I had 3" boots on, took off my shoes and she was taller than me, it didn't matter.
Honestly though if you can find a great spot in your city for daygame hit it hardcore you will eventually forget some women you approached and you will re approach them but who cares just get out there

[Vice]

This dude is going to have some nasty stories in his log soon <3

[Rice]

@kratjeuh I usually use charm at 1/2 - 2/3 strength depending on how bad my expression is, and then throw in holywood 4 at half as well. But in the photos I added here I just straight up used filters at maximum setting. The no makeup thing is an excellent idea btw I just tried it out. I usually use a light tan to offset the whiteness but it doesn't fix the glossiness.


@Lusty69 Amazing. This is pure gold. I didn't realize you cold approached for that long. No wonder you have the killer instinct necessary to straight up catfish girls (and I say this with utmost respect). This is something I strive to do as well but until recently I didn't have the confidence for it.

For the longest time I would feel insecure even just putting unedited photos of myself as I thought I was already catfishing girls by being short. I've prob only got about 4-5 months of consistent cold approach experience at this point and its already changed my mindset a lot.

I can't thank you enough for dropping in as this is exactly the kind of inspiration I was looking for.

[Ed_]

Is it because I am too fuckboy for Hinge? maybe. But I doubt it. I think its because I am forced to list my height and that instantly disqualifies me. If there are any other guys here who are 5'5 or shorter and get good results on Hinge then please respond. (@Ed_ ?)

I have my height as 5'7" on my Hinge profile and I get matches. Not a lot with my ideal dating market (hot 18 to 22 year olds), but I do get matches, numbers and a date every month or two.

[Rice]

Is it because I am too fuckboy for Hinge? maybe. But I doubt it. I think its because I am forced to list my height and that instantly disqualifies me. If there are any other guys here who are 5'5 or shorter and get good results on Hinge then please respond. (@Ed_ ?)

I have my height as 5'7" on my Hinge profile and I get matches. Not a lot with my ideal dating market (hot 18 to 22 year olds), but I do get matches, numbers and a date every month or two.

Damn.

I remember from your interview with Andy that you were killing it a few years ago. A monthly frequency is pretty bad for the caliber of profile that you have and really shows how insane the market is today. I am determined to make something work though. Even if it means lying that I am 6ft and then frame battling the girl on it IRL if thats what it takes.

[Brother_Tucker]

Rice what are you even dating for?

I remember writing on your log ages ago and seeing that you were all over the place. I think you want to screw around but you kind of want a girlfriend?

Going beyond your profile and messaging and onto the girls you do convert. Why is your retention so low? If you were keeping 2 girls a month on a 3 girl rotation, you wouldn't have time to be worrying about getting more girls in. Using the step your on (dates) clearly your not delivering good dates. If you did, these girls you do get out, you would be enjoying and the whole process wouldn't be stressing you out.

Going a step back from that, your text game is super low effort and it shows. You barely acknowledge what the girl says before you snap go for the number. There's no chance for Push and pull or banter, it's the irl version of looking at someone, smiling and then changing the subject right infront of their face. You don't need a million messages, but you inbox like every other fuck boy on there, so while you pass the first filter, you kill yourself on the second.

This isn't a profile thing, your photos are strong. To be honest it probably is an app thing. I find that on hinged I'm on fire because I'm very good at contextual openers and follow up banter. I tend to do really well with young professionals who want a guy who has their shit together. I really don't do well with girls that are clearly useless outside of the bedroom (professional party girls). Each of the dating eco systems are different and there's probably a mix up of skills you need to succeed on each one.

Lastly, don't lie and say your 6ft tall, the last thing you need is to be put on blast all over social media as "that guy who added a ft to their hight".

[kratjeuh]

Even if it means lying that I am 6ft and then frame battling the girl on it IRL if thats what it takes.

Just put your height at the max because it can come across as funny instead of insane catfisching

[rohanp]

Hey dude, Awesome log and congratulations for getting out there.

Just wanted to share from a 5'3.5" short fat kid. Daygame is your friend if you want quality is what I found over my years, been doing pick up for 12 years but spent about 6 years of that in relationships and the first year or so not really taking it seriously, along with 1 other year off with injuries so actively going out for maybe 4 years.

My advice is don't see yourself as an incel, my mindset was always like I know this pick up stuff so I can hack the system of what society says I should be or whatever the norms are. I guess then all I did was work harder than anyone else especially when I started out and I was learning. If you have only done 400 approaches and gotten 14 lays you are doing well.

It took me close to 1000 approaches to get my first lay when I was 18 and a complete utter loser retard who finished school with no friends and no social skills, I learned social skills through cold approach, actually daygame has to be one of the biggest hacks for public speaking and networking skills I have carried over to business success now.

With the face app stuff, I heavily face apped and did headshots only the last time I did a run online dating, I had maybe half the girls go that I catfished them, the other half I made super horny they didn't care, and the ones that catfished my back that I decided to sleep with stayed around much longer, but I did a steak of about 1 new girl per week after doing about 2-3 dates per week which took me Bumble, Hinge daily swiping.

Big take away for me is that online dating will always yield lower quality as I never have had that great of photos but I would say my text game and everything else is very on point after all the years.

For you, you are doing really fucking well, up the daygame, and wear some height increasing shoes if you go out at night, most girls wear heels so when you both take your shoes off they are shorter than you or don't notice or care, the hottest girl I pulled from nightgame was this fitness model back ages ago from night game with fake tits who had flat shoes and I had 3" boots on, took off my shoes and she was taller than me, it didn't matter.
Honestly though if you can find a great spot in your city for daygame hit it hardcore you will eventually forget some women you approached and you will re approach them but who cares just get out there

How much faceapp do you use?

[Rice]

Even if it means lying that I am 6ft and then frame battling the girl on it IRL if thats what it takes.

Just put your height at the max because it can come across as funny instead of insane catfisching

I did this for a full month already and if anything it hurt my matches more than 5'5. The only thing I haven't tried yet is setting my height to an average number like 5'10. Will do that now and report back my findings. I may or may not actually go on any dates, but this will answer once and for all if its the height cucking me or something else.

With that in mind, I don't know how believable it is though. I've had a few tinder girls tell me they expected me to be on the shorter side. They just didn't care and still met up anyway.

Also my Hinge in general is weird af. I get incoming likes every few days but its from fat chicks. I also matched a few hot girls this way (who ghosted) but virtually none of my outgoing likes match.

[Lusty69]

Hey dude, Awesome log and congratulations for getting out there.

Just wanted to share from a 5'3.5" short fat kid. Daygame is your friend if you want quality is what I found over my years, been doing pick up for 12 years but spent about 6 years of that in relationships and the first year or so not really taking it seriously, along with 1 other year off with injuries so actively going out for maybe 4 years.

My advice is don't see yourself as an incel, my mindset was always like I know this pick up stuff so I can hack the system of what society says I should be or whatever the norms are. I guess then all I did was work harder than anyone else especially when I started out and I was learning. If you have only done 400 approaches and gotten 14 lays you are doing well.

It took me close to 1000 approaches to get my first lay when I was 18 and a complete utter loser retard who finished school with no friends and no social skills, I learned social skills through cold approach, actually daygame has to be one of the biggest hacks for public speaking and networking skills I have carried over to business success now.

With the face app stuff, I heavily face apped and did headshots only the last time I did a run online dating, I had maybe half the girls go that I catfished them, the other half I made super horny they didn't care, and the ones that catfished my back that I decided to sleep with stayed around much longer, but I did a steak of about 1 new girl per week after doing about 2-3 dates per week which took me Bumble, Hinge daily swiping.

Big take away for me is that online dating will always yield lower quality as I never have had that great of photos but I would say my text game and everything else is very on point after all the years.

For you, you are doing really fucking well, up the daygame, and wear some height increasing shoes if you go out at night, most girls wear heels so when you both take your shoes off they are shorter than you or don't notice or care, the hottest girl I pulled from nightgame was this fitness model back ages ago from night game with fake tits who had flat shoes and I had 3" boots on, took off my shoes and she was taller than me, it didn't matter.
Honestly though if you can find a great spot in your city for daygame hit it hardcore you will eventually forget some women you approached and you will re approach them but who cares just get out there

How much faceapp do you use?

I just use the preset called handsome and because I am fat I use small face, and depending on how the preset worked and lighting I might add a tiny tan

[rohanp]

How much faceapp do you use?

I just use the preset called handsome and because I am fat I use small face, and depending on how the preset worked and lighting I might add a tiny tan

Handsome 1-2 is not much catfishing. But 3-4 is straight up catfish. The small face is def catfish lol

[Lusty69]

I just use the preset called handsome and because I am fat I use small face, and depending on how the preset worked and lighting I might add a tiny tan

Handsome 1-2 is not much catfishing. But 3-4 is straight up catfish. The small face is def catfish lol

Yeah I do handsome 1 and smaller face on one of the lower presets along with only using face photos and no body shots due to my current fatness which I have been struggling to shift but with that style I got quite a few matches and about 5 lays with decent enough looking women, one pretty good one the other 4 were just average looking.

[Aku]

@Rice

Damn, I got click baited,

Sup bro

First of all, you are not 'too ugly'. Imo you look attractive and clearly made efforts in that area.

I haven't done any online dating in the past year except 1 time to get rid of my boosts on my old phone, so I'm not sure if it has changed, but since we are living in the same city and we met IRL I can share you my experience.

Also, yea I know I'm tall... and also my memory is shit so I might not remember things accurately, but here I go...

>> 50 dates in a 6 month period from May 2022 to November 2022

wow that is a lot, I think I did like 50 in my 1st year

>>2-4 matches a day automatically, so in the 2 months its been running I have gotten over 300 matches

This seems like a lot to me. I'm pretty sure you are somewhere at the top of users with most matches. I'm pretty sure I never got that many matches on tinder.

I used to get 0-2 passive likes per week. And if my memory is correct around 7 matches per boosts. Last time I used tinder I was using the double boost once on sunday (90min) with a lot of success getting 20+ matches by double boost. Before that I was doing 2 normal boosts per week.

So the number of matches on tinder seems good.

>>Except I've only gotten 3 dates and one lay
Yea only 3 dates for 300+ matches seems pretty bad


>>This seems obvious thats its "text game" but I don't see it. My texting has a few steps:
1. Clickbait opener
2. Compliment, sexual if possible (somehow how all my lays been with the compliment: "I like your style, the dress really shows off those curves"

I know lots of guys would probably disagree with me, but I personally don't like the 'I like your style, the dress really shows off those curves' at all. I would avoid this. I'm trying to think how my female friends would react to this if they were swiping by my side and I can only imagine neutral or negative reactions unless she's a gym girl that puts effort in growing her butt and would like the free validation.
I think in general its a bad idea to directly compliment girls body/looks (when you don't know them at least). Imo better compliments would be: what she's wearing, outfit, nails, hair, accessories, etc.

I agree with Andy that you should avoid sexualizing before the date. Imo, it just increases the flake rate to ungodly amounts. Maybe she's horny in the moment at night in her bed texting, but 2 days later on the night of the date, after work she might feel reluctant about meeting that guy she said all those things to and with the built up expectations.



>>Its also worth noting that I have never gotten a single date from Hinge despite having matched 200+ girls
wtf, how is that possible

For me I would say my dates were maybe 45%tinder 40%hinge 15% Fruitz. A lot of the times Hinge was the better app.
Maybe its the height thing idk. Also, I think hinge can deliver greater results if you are confident/good vide and you are using voice msg. If you both vibe through voice messages, you are very likely to meet.


Btw the Fruitz app is maybe something to consider. I paid premium and didn't get consistent results at first , but in the summer I met a bunch of great DTF girls from this app.
Though its mostly French-speaking girls on there, so it might be harder for you.

I think in general here there's a lot of people from all over the world, and most french canadian girls are bilingual, but I have a feeling maybe some girls might have an easier time making a connection/dating French-fluent guys. So I can see it being a bit harder with them in particular.

>>About Gen Z girls no effort texting
I think you are right about giving up too early. I mean girls are bombarded by guys on tinder, you cannot expect them to put effort in every msg. Imo if she doesn't give you much, try to push it until you get a yes/no. Also if she acts bored, don't be a nice guy and qualify to her. I would rather say stupid shit and get a blowout than saying boring shit to a bored girl. Like with girls that makes zero effort i used to just ask them a really stupid FMK question to break the interaction. If she doesn't bother putting effort into playing the game and explaining her answer/reasoning, I move on to the next, but a lots of girls would find it funny and I got a bunch of dates with this. With girls that didn't gave me much at first.

Also, last date I had from tinder was a Filipina. She would only respond with few words to my msg. Looked like no effort. Well I met her IRL and turns out she was just ultra shy, very insecure girl and had shit social skills, but we still we made it work.

>>diversity
Also you say you only go for white girls, so ofc it probably limits your options a bit more than the rest of guys

>>About catfishing
I think its a good thing to look better on the app than IRL (As long as the difference is not extreme). Like the McDonald burger that seems so much better on TV. It's just having good marketing. I find girls care more about looks online than IRL. And they are the OG master catfisher obv.

I'm not sure what you were trying to show with that screenshot of the girl trying to make sure you are not fake. I think she was just trying to make sure you were not an actual fake account, especially with your professional photos. I would just send her a selfie of me outside (with good lighting and angle), but not worry too much about it. Voice messages can help too.

>>lonely girls with cat
I met a lot of girls like this. They have a cat and watch netflix. From my experience, these girls live in scarcity. A lot of them just work 9 to 5(or study full time) and go back home, are lonely and don't have a great social life (especially after the COco). They don't meet that many potential guys IRL. Then they try to use tinder, are overwhelmed, have to filter through all the crap(guys) and find it exhausting.



I also think a great way to improve 'game', is keeping girls you like around. When you have options, something happens in your mind and you just act less needy/more attractive and you're less worried about scarcity.


Here you go, that was my massive wall of crap. Hopefully, there is some value somewhere in there.

[rohanp]

@Rice

Damn, I got click baited,

Sup bro

First of all, you are not 'too ugly'. Imo you look attractive and clearly made efforts in that area.

I haven't done any online dating in the past year except 1 time to get rid of my boosts on my old phone, so I'm not sure if it has changed, but since we are living in the same city and we met IRL I can share you my experience.

Also, yea I know I'm tall... and also my memory is shit so I might not remember things accurately, but here I go...

>> 50 dates in a 6 month period from May 2022 to November 2022

wow that is a lot, I think I did like 50 in my 1st year

>>2-4 matches a day automatically, so in the 2 months its been running I have gotten over 300 matches

This seems like a lot to me. I'm pretty sure you are somewhere at the top of users with most matches. I'm pretty sure I never got that many matches on tinder.

I used to get 0-2 passive likes per week. And if my memory is correct around 7 matches per boosts. Last time I used tinder I was using the double boost once on sunday (90min) with a lot of success getting 20+ matches by double boost. Before that I was doing 2 normal boosts per week.

So the number of matches on tinder seems good.

>>Except I've only gotten 3 dates and one lay
Yea only 3 dates for 300+ matches seems pretty bad


>>This seems obvious thats its "text game" but I don't see it. My texting has a few steps:
1. Clickbait opener
2. Compliment, sexual if possible (somehow how all my lays been with the compliment: "I like your style, the dress really shows off those curves"

I know lots of guys would probably disagree with me, but I personally don't like the 'I like your style, the dress really shows off those curves' at all. I would avoid this. I'm trying to think how my female friends would react to this if they were swiping by my side and I can only imagine neutral or negative reactions unless she's a gym girl that puts effort in growing her butt and would like the free validation.
I think in general its a bad idea to directly compliment girls body/looks (when you don't know them at least). Imo better compliments would be: what she's wearing, outfit, nails, hair, accessories, etc.

I agree with Andy that you should avoid sexualizing before the date. Imo, it just increases the flake rate to ungodly amounts. Maybe she's horny in the moment at night in her bed texting, but 2 days later on the night of the date, after work she might feel reluctant about meeting that guy she said all those things to and with the built up expectations.



>>Its also worth noting that I have never gotten a single date from Hinge despite having matched 200+ girls
wtf, how is that possible

For me I would say my dates were maybe 45%tinder 40%hinge 15% Fruitz. A lot of the times Hinge was the better app.
Maybe its the height thing idk. Also, I think hinge can deliver greater results if you are confident/good vide and you are using voice msg. If you both vibe through voice messages, you are very likely to meet.


Btw the Fruitz app is maybe something to consider. I paid premium and didn't get consistent results at first , but in the summer I met a bunch of great DTF girls from this app.
Though its mostly French-speaking girls on there, so it might be harder for you.

I think in general here there's a lot of people from all over the world, and most french canadian girls are bilingual, but I have a feeling maybe some girls might have an easier time making a connection/dating French-fluent guys. So I can see it being a bit harder with them in particular.

>>About Gen Z girls no effort texting
I think you are right about giving up too early. I mean girls are bombarded by guys on tinder, you cannot expect them to put effort in every msg. Imo if she doesn't give you much, try to push it until you get a yes/no. Also if she acts bored, don't be a nice guy and qualify to her. I would rather say stupid shit and get a blowout than saying boring shit to a bored girl. Like with girls that makes zero effort i used to just ask them a really stupid FMK question to break the interaction. If she doesn't bother putting effort into playing the game and explaining her answer/reasoning, I move on to the next, but a lots of girls would find it funny and I got a bunch of dates with this. With girls that didn't gave me much at first.

Also, last date I had from tinder was a Filipina. She would only respond with few words to my msg. Looked like no effort. Well I met her IRL and turns out she was just ultra shy, very insecure girl and had shit social skills, but we still we made it work.

>>diversity
Also you say you only go for white girls, so ofc it probably limits your options a bit more than the rest of guys

>>About catfishing
I think its a good thing to look better on the app than IRL (As long as the difference is not extreme). Like the McDonald burger that seems so much better on TV. It's just having good marketing. I find girls care more about looks online than IRL. And they are the OG master catfisher obv.

I'm not sure what you were trying to show with that screenshot of the girl trying to make sure you are not fake. I think she was just trying to make sure you were not an actual fake account, especially with your professional photos. I would just send her a selfie of me outside (with good lighting and angle), but not worry too much about it. Voice messages can help too.

>>lonely girls with cat
I met a lot of girls like this. They have a cat and watch netflix. From my experience, these girls live in scarcity. A lot of them just work 9 to 5(or study full time) and go back home, are lonely and don't have a great social life (especially after the COco). They don't meet that many potential guys IRL. Then they try to use tinder, are overwhelmed, have to filter through all the crap(guys) and find it exhausting.



I also think a great way to improve 'game', is keeping girls you like around. When you have options, something happens in your mind and you just act less needy/more attractive and you're less worried about scarcity.


Here you go, that was my massive wall of crap. Hopefully, there is some value somewhere in there.

One thing i’ve started to notice is that girls themsleves are insecure about their online looks vs IRL. Had a girl ask me on FT if she thought i was a catfish.